The Words We Use and How They Influence Teachers with Jessica Vance, Ep. 141 Buzzing with Ms. B: The Coaching Podcast

Episode 141 – The Words We Use and How They Influence Teachers with Jessica Vance

buzzing with ms b 

Hey coach and welcome to Episode 141, the words we use and how they influence teachers with Jessica Vance. I am so excited to welcome my Jessica vance today because this is the last Jessica vance in this series about the human side of coaching. Next week, I will have a coaching call with a coach from the field. But as far as Jessica vances like who are experts and who are bringing information to us, Jessica Vance is the final one for this topic. I am also so glad because Jessica is a repeat Jessica vance on this podcast. Last year, we shared about talking about inquiry to support coaches and teacher growth in Episode 112. And we’ve continued chatting online a bit since then. And she talked about how she was working on this idea of how we can use language to influence and impact teachers while remaining curious. So if you follow her on Instagram, you may have seen some of her work that she’s been doing. And it’s just phenomenal. I’m really excited for her to share it with us today because I really think this encapsulates how human coaching work is. Now one thing is that on the evening of this recording, my throat was a little bit sore. I had hot tea, my cup literally cracked apart and dumped tea all over my laptop. I am not exaggerating. It was kind of the bottom of the cup cracked off. It was shocking, destroyed the laptop. So I was using an emergency situation. My husband’s laptop, I didn’t have my hot tea and partway through the episode, I think I started to sound a little froggy. So I just wanted you to be aware of that. Because, you know, life happens and it definitely happened on this day. But all of that aside, we do have a really great conversation and I’m really excited to share it with you today. So let’s let’s get Jessica here.

So welcome to the podcast. Jessica.

Jessica vance 

Thank you so much, Christy. It’s really good to be back and see you again.

buzzing with ms b 

I’m so glad that you’re joining us today. I’m really excited to talk about our topic. But before we get started with that, I would really appreciate if you could introduce yourself, in case anybody hasn’t listened to your previous episode, can you share a little bit about who you are? How you ended up here? And what kind of work you focus on?

Jessica vance 

Yes. So my day job, if you will, is in Richmond and environment coordinator at an elementary school located in Austin, Texas. And it’s a big mouthful, basically just saying that I get to support our teachers in place based learning and inquiry learning what does that look like and sound like as it connects to the standards and other district expectations. And then the enrichment part of my job is really tapping into our students curiosities and the things that they’re really interested in and providing some different opportunities to be able to explore those both connected to the curriculum, but then also just to be free and creative and kind of tap into some different things perhaps didn’t know that they were curious about. And then in addition to that, I’m a published author and do some consulting work around that supporting both international baccalaureate and other IB schools and the implementation of inquiry based teaching and learning. And my publication leading with a lens of inquiry is written from the stance of leadership and to support leaders in the approach of teaching that we know is best for our students within the classroom. But taking that lens in the role of leadership. And so getting to do both is pretty fantastic. I definitely am super grateful to be able to wear both hats to be able to be in a school and super connected with my learners. And then to be able to take those experiences and connect those with other schools and leaders and educators around the globe is quite something.

buzzing with ms b 

That’s so great. You’re doing so much great work right now. Last year, when was it last year? Yes. Last year, whenever we run podcast, we talked a little bit about, about, about that inquiry model and doing that work with teachers. And then you said, you know, something else I’ve been thinking about is the idea of using language and how our language influences and impacts teachers. So I would you give us kind of an introduction to this idea, because I think it’s such an interesting concept.

Jessica vance 

Yeah, so I think that a lot of the planning that I do with teachers when I’m working with them one on one, or with or with teams, is to really think about my approach with my work with them. And so how do I how am I really mindful and planning the types of questions that I’m asking them? And it’s really authentic, of course, but there’s a lot of intentionality because there’s a lot of thought behind it as in like, you know, I love Elena Aguilar. She talks about, you know, do our learners have skill gaps? Or is it a knowledge gap? And how can I plan to show up in those spaces with them in a way that’s really intentional, and not only am I providing different resources or ideas, but it’s also the language that invites the learners to be able to approach these new ideas or perhaps concepts in a way that’s more of an invitation. And so really delving into how do we model our thinking and language that evokes a sense of curiosity and wonder, which of course is to connect is connected to inquiry. And so, in, of course, me preparing to work with teachers. There’s a lot of intentionality with that. But then also to it’s the invitation to share with teachers as you’re working with students, like, write down these words, how much you invite your learners into the conversation. And so it’s really the model of the model. And so how can I be intentional with my language, so that way the teachers are, in turn learning using it rather with their students as well.

buzzing with ms b 

So as you’re talking about this trend about like language, kind of facilitating curiosity, and maybe opening doors for people to think about things in ways that they haven’t before? How does the language choice influence the thought or the perception of teachers in those towards those ideas?

Jessica vance 

Yeah, so one of the dispositions of an inquiry leader, as I’ve outlined in my publication is to be intentionally playful. And part of that not only is in our approach with just kind of like letting go a little bit, but it’s also with our language. And so one of the phrases that I love to utilize for myself in coaching or just even my own thinking is, I wonder what would happen if, and then all of a sudden, if I start my sentence or question with that, it’s this invitation for some new thinking for us to explore some different ideas. Perhaps if I’m working with a teacher who maybe is a bit standoffish, or is not quite, you know, accepting of some of the ideas that I’m sharing, or maybe he’s just not really connecting with what it is that I’m bringing to the table that all of a sudden provides a space for my learner, which is the teacher to say like, oh, okay, it could look this way. Or it could look another way. And it’s a gentle nudge, if you will, for the learner to make their own connection. So even if I say, I wonder what would happen if you asked your students to turn and talk, it’s not saying that that has to happen in that moment. But it’s allowing the learner or the teacher to be able to explore what could happen with that scenario. And inevitably, it just opens doors to something different. And then it becomes this CO construction of what happens. And it’s not, it starts to shift that coach and teacher dynamic wise, and like, I’m telling you this thing to do, because my principal said I have to be here, but it’s really this coaching scenario where it’s like, we’re sitting in the learning together. And so that, to me, is a question stem that I use time and time again. And I just love the invitation of thinking. And then also just again, like I said, just to be able to be able to have it be a space where we’re working with one another, especially when you’re, you’re in scenarios that maybe, you know, are feeling a little bit uncomfortable. And so I would definitely, you know, nudge your your listeners to consider what that language might do at their next coaching, you know, conversation or work with a team.

buzzing with ms b 

I love that, because that kind of moves the dialogue beyond well, what’s the best thing to do? Or what’s the next thing? And what’s the right thing to do? What are wrong things we should not do into saying, Well, what would happen if we did this? And then we can decide, is that an outcome that we want? And then we can decide whether we want to try that thing or not? But it does it pushes the thinking beyond well, what’s the right answer here? And we see that in classrooms as well, teachers, teachers will come to you as the coach and say, Well, what what am I supposed to do? Or what’s the right, you know, what is the answer here? And then we see those teachers also turn around with their students. And they’re like, Okay, this is the answer, that you’re getting it wrong, right? Instead of, instead of exploring different possibilities. So I really love that because it can train the thinking over time to to be more open to different possibilities.

Jessica vance 

Yeah, and I think it also just models like the thinking and language, which is the theme of inquiry, too, right? It’s like, what can this do for us? Or where might this learning take us? Or what do you think? Or what knowledge do you have that might impact or support? What it is that we’re investigating or exploring with one another?

buzzing with ms b 

Yeah, with the same question, each teacher is going to have a different response to that. So their own knowledge base and their own experience is going to give them a different perspective on that question that you’re asking what could happen if we did this? So I do love that. How can we so we, you know, teachers often see the barriers whenever they work with kids, and this isn’t going to work? Because I don’t think my kids are not gonna be able to do this. My kids can’t XYZ. And so how can we use language to help teachers move beyond those barriers that they perceive?

Jessica vance 

Yeah, so another question that I really lean in on often. And this is from the work of Mark church and Ron Ritchhart, is what makes you say that. So if I have teachers who say my kids can’t fill in the blank, right, do that, or ask good questions or complete this problem solving? You know, I will lean in and ask What makes you say that. And it’s really important that when we’re asking these questions that we’re leaning in with a sense of curiosity, I might have these preconceived notions of what this teacher is already going to say. But I really have to be mindful and intentional with like, leaning in for what it is that the teacher is sharing and what they’re saying. But also, what are they not? So saying, so in that moment, if they say, Well, my kids can’t solve problems or math problems, two step problems? Well, what makes you say that, typically, that question is just the nudge enough for that teacher to stop and pause and to reflect. And sometimes teachers, of course, will just say, Well, I’ve already tried it. And so then that’s an again, another invitation for me to ask another question. Well, I’m really curious, what did that look like when you tried it? Right? And so I’m leaning in, of course, your listeners can’t see me leaning into you right now, to my learners to be able to find out a little bit more. And so it’s a really easy way for us to again, extend this conversation and leaning into potential barriers. And I and I got this from a leader, she said, you know, Jessica, the barriers are the way and I love that because really a barrier to me if you’re talking about the language of inquiry is a provocation, which really is an invitation to stretch our thinking towards something new and something different. And so I love to lift up barriers. I call them the habits whenever I am leading different sessions, professional development sessions, or even one on one coaching Session, I’ll say, Okay, now tell me what your Yeah, but is. And I love that because let’s lift up the stuff that we’re scared of that we’re afraid of the things that we’ve tried and they haven’t worked, like, let’s just put that all on the table. And let’s sort that together and make meaning together in a way that, again, is this invitation of like inviting this conversation and not trying to come at it where we can, of course, as coaches feel like, well, I need to tell you, because you just don’t know. But it keeps me curious in that moment, when I approach things with a sense of curiosity, and I ask questions that way. And then I view these barriers as an opportunity for us to explore and uncover some things together. And this is where my learner’s my adult learners are at so how can I meet them with where they are at in that moment?

buzzing with ms b 

You know, I really like about that is that language choice, it impacts the people that you’re working with. But I think it also influences the way that we are thinking in the moment because sometimes, like you’re saying, we do have all these preconceived ideas, I shouldn’t even say sometimes we often Oh, most of the time, we have an idea of what we expect people to do or say. And so that language, sometimes it can feel forced. But over time, it can change the way that you think about the way you interact with certain people. So I do really like that.

Jessica vance 

Yeah, our mindset is everything. And typically to, if I have a team or a teacher who I know, I have those kind of like, if not really looking forward to moments, I’ll really give myself a stop and pause. And I’ll set an intention for myself. And that’s just giving my mind some language about how it is that I want to show up to this meeting, right. So if I have a teacher who, you know, potentially I know, might resist some of the suggestions or things that we’re exploring, I’ll just give myself a moment to say, okay, like, how do I want to show up today? How do I want to feel at the end of this session together? And usually that intention, if it’s just like a word is like empowered, or motivated or excited or whatever word it is, that’s enough for like my mind to start shifting and be more creative and kind of open to what it is that we’re going to explore with one another?

buzzing with ms b 

Yeah, that’s a great practice. So you mentioned a few really powerful question stems that you can use. Are there any others that you have used that really have seen the benefit of supporting teachers and kind of changing the way they’re thinking about something?

Jessica vance 

Um, I think, yeah, what makes you say that, and I wonder what would happen if? And then I think also, too. It’s all about your body language, right? Like, there’s not like the perfect question. I was talking to Steve Bartlett Barkley a couple of months ago. And we were talking about questions, because I love questions. But there’s not really the perfect question. But it’s, it’s the curiosity behind the question. That’s the right question, if you will. So you know, tell me more a little bit about that is different than tell me more about that. Right. And it’s like, of course, its tone, of course, his body language. But am I curious? In the asking of the question, that, to me, is the power of the question. And so I would say those two that I shared are definitely probably the most powerful and ones that I lean into most often. But it’s got to be my mindset. It has to be your mindset when you’re going into that space. And if you don’t have that mindset of being curious, then that is your stop and pause moment as a coach to be able to find that where can you be curious in that moment? How can you view your adult learners as having skill gaps, as still being 3040 50 Somethings and not all the things even though they’ve been at this practice for a really long time?

buzzing with ms b 

I was going to ask you about that. How did you cultivate this framework of curiosity to approach your work through that, because that mindset shift is a huge one for coaches. And it’s, especially as the year goes on, and you get to know people better, it comes back, it becomes harder and harder to come from that place sometimes.

Jessica vance 

You know, I think having a really strong inquiry practice as a teacher in the classroom has lent itself to being a really strong inquiry leader and inquiry coach, seeing when I leaned into curiosity with my students, how that empowered them how that motivated them, how that led us down some really amazing paths with one another while teaching the standards. So I just took that same approach with my adult learners. And again, it’s tricky because you think that you’re an adult, so you should know. But we’re really we’re all just at different spaces, as we’re learning and kind of uncovering our practices educators and so the more that I remember that adults are learners to and the more that I really kind of ground myself in that sense of curiosity, and kind of saying to myself, I You know, is this something that they just can’t do yet? How might I help them scaffold to where it is that I know that they can be, and really viewing the coaching experience as this long term practice that we’re engaged in with one another, right. So like the teachers that I currently am coaching with on my current campus, we’re delving into reflection. And this, these have been seeds that we’ve planted like four years ago, right. So I’ve been utilizing thinking routines are a fantastic tool, not only to use with your students in the classroom, but they’re a really fantastic tool to use with adult learners as well, because they scaffold the thinking that we want our learners to engage in. And so these are things that I’ve utilized with my learners four years ago, and continue to do so now. And I’m only just beginning to see the fruits of the labor of those seeds that have been planted. And so I think viewing the coaching cycle, and viewing your time with your adult learners, as this longer visionary, like experience, also kind of helps remain me curious about what it is that we might unpack, and then also being open to potentially, you know, what are the things that they’re curious about? And how might I take the things that my adult learners are curious about? And use those to leverage the work that I know that I can do with them? Right. So although inquiry is part of who I am, and what I know, is best teaching and learning, it’s not necessarily what my learners knew four years ago, but how can I still tap into the things that they’re curious about, and make those connections along the way, but not have it the force, right? So I’m getting their feedback, I’m asking them questions with a sense of curiosity. I’m tying those things into professional learning with a lot of intentionality. And so I think that when we can be really mindful and have those stop and pause moments for ourselves to not force something to fit, and really like, be mindful with that approach is I think, when we begin to start seeing a shift in who we are as coaches, and what it is that we get to do with our adult learners as well.

buzzing with ms b 

You mentioned, well, I’d read Bruce really liked that, because you’re talking about what we can do really, to get teachers to become invested in this process as well. Because whenever it reflects their interests, that reflects things that they’re curious about, then you don’t have to work on buy in, you know, people are very focused on buying, because it doesn’t meet the teachers needs, right, whenever we’re trying to say, well, how can we get teachers to agree to this, then we’re already coming at them with something that we know they’re not interested in. You know, that is a reality. Sometimes things do come down, you know, from wherever they come from. And you we do have to find a way to make it relevant. Right, right. As coaches, I feel like we’re the people in the middle who can say, Okay, this is what they’re saying, What can I do to make this a better fit for my people? How can I make this actually work after? And what can I share with teachers and get their input and figure out how they want to make it work? Because sometimes we have more wiggle room than people realize?

Jessica vance 

Yeah, yeah. You know, there’s something this year, we’ve been delving into data a lot, as I’m sure a lot of your listeners probably would be nodding their heads as they’re listening. And so of course, like, as my principal and I were talking about these data meetings, we knew that our teachers were going to start to feel the pressures start to feel anxiety as they walked into this, this, this data meeting, and this half day of learning, and we stopped and paused and we said, okay, what are the things that we value that we know are really important with who we are as a school community? And one of those is curiosity. So we said, okay, how can we ground ourselves in this day, and this time with our teachers with a sense of curiosity? What is something that we can have our learners engage in? And also do this must do that the district was outlining for us? So we utilize the question formulation technique, to be able to not only teach a questioning protocol, but to really ground ourselves again, like I said, in that value. So we looked at a set of data. And we walked through this question formulation technique with our teachers, which if you’re not familiar with the work of Dan Rothstein, and Lou Santana, I definitely encourage your listeners to go out and look for who they are the Right Question Institute has a plethora of lots of really great resources, questioning protocol, and just what this looks like in sounds like from pre K all the way up to adults. And so it’s a questioning protocol that we utilize as a structure to look at data. So instead of this sense of anxiety, we wanted our teachers to look at data with a sense of curiosity. And so all of a sudden, we were doing the must do, if you will, but in something that was that we valued. And from this protocol, we lifted up the things that were important to our teachers. So we were still able to, you know, look at something that was really important and drive our next steps and of course meet our district needs. But to do it really framed in something that we believed was really important. And so we can take what came up from that experience. And of course, it’s a protocol our teachers can use within the classroom. But that gave us a sense of what was important to them. And how can we design our next steps, our professional learning our coaching model, all these different parts and pieces from what it was that our learners were already telling us that they were curious about. But it’s because we asked them, right, and oftentimes teachers aren’t asked, What are you curious about? Just get talked at, instead of invited to a conversation centered around curiosity are the things that they you know, potentially want to go explore? And I can’t tell you, Christy, how many times when I asked some teachers like, what are you curious about growing in your practice, sometimes they don’t know what to say, because they’ve never been asked. And so, you know, that is definitely work that I am really passionate and actively engaged in with leaders of saying, You need to ask your teachers where they’re engaged in. And if they don’t know what they’re excited about, then this is our opportunity to provoke that type of thinking within our learners and give them some space to explore and figure out what it is that they potentially want to go delve into a little bit more further and deeply into.

buzzing with ms b 

Yes, absolutely. You mentioned a little while back, you mentioned reflection. And I know that I’ve seen you do some work, you know, you share lots of stuff on your your Instagram account, lots of great reels. And so I know you’ve done some work about like, kind of what our perception of reflection is, versus what it should actually be or what it actually is. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Jessica vance 

Yeah, so you know, whenever you think about reflection, you definitely think about, you know, or I would say most people think, oh, it has to be this time where I’m sitting and I’m, I’m quiet, and I have some like really relaxing music, and maybe my journal. And that’s what we think reflection has to be this thing that takes too much time. And while that is one way that we can reflect on who we are or practice or days or experiences, really reflection is a multitude of skills, that interweave with one another. So reflection is actually showing and modeling curiosity, right. So I’ve kind of shared a couple of different answers of what that could look like in sound like it comes in our language, it comes in provocations, it comes in with just like leaning in, and just observing what’s around us. Reflection is also listening. So you know, listening for the things that our learners are saying and what they’re telling us. And that’s the input or the data that we respond to. But also what are they not saying what’s behind the words that they’re not expressing to us? And how can we lean in and listen really vigorously? That’s, that’s some language from Ron Machar. I love that listening vigorously is something that is such a tangible has like a lot of texture to that. Reflection is also modeling thinking and language, which is again, some of the things that we’re kind of exploring already today in our chat of like, when we are sitting with our learners and saying, you know, this is making me think about or when you say that it reminds me of, it helps our learners know that we’re thinking about our thinking of previous experiences, our schema, we’re utilizing language such as this makes me curious about or I’m wondering a little bit more of so how can we really model our thinking and language for our learners not only to reflect ourselves, but so that way they know this is what happens when you’re thinking or when you’re reflecting. Collaboration to is another skill of reflection? And how do we provide our learners and ourselves time to turn and talk with some really great rich sentence stems just structure that conversation, how we’re utilizing different collaborative structures, whether it may be Kagan or give one get one, that sort of thing? So what are we giving? How are we giving our learners opportunities to co construct meaning with one another, while we’re walking around and being really intentional and listening to what is happening? And then of course to and this is probably not a surprise, because we’re educators is relationships. And the more that we know about our learners, the more we’re able to model that thinking and language and connect with them and be curious about the things that they are drawn to or the interest that they have. And so building those relationships, so that way, there’s that psychological safety for our learners to take risks are all part of what it means to reflect and how we can sharpen those skills of reflection.

buzzing with ms b 

That’s awesome. You mentioned provocation, and I would love for people who are unfamiliar with this. Would you share a little bit about that?

Jessica vance 

Yeah, so provocations are simple although they’re Such a complexity to them. And I’d say that I spend most of my time along with planning questions on provocations, so provocations and invite the learner to the learning, right? They spark curiosity and wonder, they provoke thinking. And really a rich provocation is grounded in some conceptual understanding. And when I’m designing a provocation, it’s a learning experience that doesn’t just happen at the start of the unit, there can actually be several provocations within a unit of inquiry. I’ll ask teachers and I’ll ask myself as I’m designing professional learning, what kind of thinking do you want your learner’s to engage in? And how might you invite them into the learning? So just as I shared with you already, the that data meeting with our teachers, we wanted our teachers to be curious about their students, right. And so that was the kind of thinking that we wanted them to engage in. If I’m doing this with a teacher who’s designing perhaps a unit on fractions, I’ll ask them the same question. And so they’re like, Well, I know, I need to look at different types of models, right, we’ll have to have standard and non standard, and we’ll talk about different types of materials that the teachers can use to be able to invite that conversation. Some easy provocations are usually a video or a series of photos. I’ll usually call it a provocation carousel, where we show our learners a series of photos really intentionally, and maybe a couple of questions or prompts like what do you see? What do you wonder what do you know, it might be just an invitation of some different stations around the room with some different thinking routines. So the idea of a provocation, in a sense, could be pre assessment, but it’s to provoke the thinking within our learners to be able to have them and capture that curiosity, so that we can plan our next steps. So even though as teachers will plan out a unit, if we’re designing a really powerful provocation, we’ll be able to lift up some really great pieces, perhaps misconceptions and questions and tie them to things that we’ve already planned, where we don’t have to convince our learners to be able to like, be interested in fractions because no offense but who loves fractions? I don’t. But then it’s coming from them. Right. So if we design this provocation, and we capture questions, for example, again, I’m a really big proponent of questions. We can say, you know, Christy, last week, when we were looking at some of the different photos you asked a question about, right, and I could directly tie you to the learning in a way that, again, invites you to this space, and builds that relationship, which again, is what we’ve said, is a skill of reflection. And it tells our learners that we care about them and who they are. And I’m talking about my students, but these are the very same things that I do when I’m designing professional development for my adult learners as well. And, and I’d say I do it really intentionally, because we’re all human. So whether we’re eight, or 18, or 38, we all learn in the same way. And so adopting this model, and again, just as you’ve said, provocations is really a really powerful place to, for us to start when it comes to inquiry. And it starts to even just trying to nudge ourselves towards like, the curiosity of our learners as well.

buzzing with ms b 

Having such an open ended response, you know, that there, everybody’s going to respond to it differently. It can create that cultivate that, that curiosity, and I think it kind of your language has to shift whenever you’re approaching your work that way, because there is not a right or wrong or next step, or whatever the answer is, it’s open ended response. And so people are going to look at things and come up with completely different, you know, I mean, I’ve used it as, like, you mentioned, gallery walk stations around the room where people go, and they write and they record different things. And sometimes you were, it’s surprising what people come up with, because of their background, their backgrounds, and their experiences are so different than when I don’t I mean, I know that one thing that I tend to do is I think, Oh, well, people might say this about this, they might say that about that. But then whenever you actually read responses, it’s not this, some people might say what you were thinking, but then there’s stuff that’s like completely unexpected,

Jessica vance 

which is great. And it it takes a little bit of risk taking right to facilitate something like that. But then again, it’s coming from the learner. So how much more powerful is it right? And so I don’t need to do the heavy lifting. I’m gonna let my learners do the heavy lifting. I’m just going to be really intentional and mindful. What if what it is I’m presenting for you to kind of chew on and explore and talk about, you know, with your peers or however it is that I decide to set up that provocation.

buzzing with ms b 

So provocations with teachers are you like would you consider data a provocation? And you Okay, great. Can you talk a little bit more about it? provocations you’ve used with adult.

Jessica vance 

Yeah, so, um, I love utilizing just different types of videos that I kind of curate over, you know, Instagram to be honest, I save and bookmark, but a bunch of different things in that way. Margaret Wheatley, I love her work. If you’re not a fan, or you do not know who Margaret Wheatley is, she has a fantastic piece of called willingness to be disturbed. And it’s a short article about just kind of, you know, who we are as educators and why it is that we are here? And how do you know the things that you know? And so I love her work. Of course, Adam Grant, he has some really great pieces, too. He’s amazing and fantastic at tweeting. So sometimes I’ll just collect and curate some different types of tweets. Of course, it depends on what it is that I’m trying to provoke within my learners, right. But I’d say like, those are definitely some ones that I kind of go back to time and time again. And really, you know, although a provocation is it, it can be designed, or traditionally, it’s designed by the facilitator of the learning, a provocation can come from the learners themselves. So let’s say I’ve had some sort of professional development or some sort of adult learning session. And then I utilize, you know, maybe a retrieval strategy or some sort of thinking routine, or I capture some sort of reflection from my learners. Maybe in the form of like a question. And that could be the questions that I collect from my learners can actually be the provocation for what it is that we’re going to explore and unpack next. So back in the fall, I did a session with teachers about making and keeping thinking visible and the power of that, and why do we do that. And we engaged in one of the thinking routines, which is tug of war, which is another one of my favorites, time and time again, it’s super powerful. And I collect, I kept the anchor charts from that experience, of course, during that day, and during that session, we utilize those to drive the learning, but I kept them on my learning wall in my office. And then later those became a provocation to start off conversation with something else. And so that’s also the nuance of a provocation that I would really invite your learners to consider and reflect on as well, is how we design provocations, but also for listening, again, a skill of reflection, we can get provocations from the learners themselves. And then again, they’re doing the heavy lifting, and we don’t have to do all the work. And because it’s from them, they’re automatically going to be curious and feel connected with what it is that we’re exploring and unpacking with one another. So I think those probably give your listeners a little bit of a start, you know, I’ll kind of share a teacher hat Krissy, if you don’t mind, you know, with that. So as teachers, we’re always like collecting all the things, right, but keeping track of them is tricky. So with the Google extension pocket, if you just add that as an extension, what you can do then is as you see things online, or you see a video, or maybe there’s a post on NPR, or maybe some video on YouTube, or whatever it is, somebody shares something with you, you can add it to your pocket, if you will, but then you can tag it a bunch of different things. So yeah, so I have like, over the past 10 years curated this collection now of things that I can go back to, and all target as many different things that I can think of. So like let’s say I saw a video or like a TED Talk video about curiosity, I might tag it as curiosity or provocation or professional development or student agency or creativity. And I’ll try to list as many things as I can just in that moment. So that way later, when I go into my pocket, I can search by these tags. And so then all of a sudden, I have this huge collection of things that I can dive into. And so whether or not I’m utilizing it for myself as a provocation, it also is a great way for me to curate resources with for teachers over the years. And it’s just a nice way for me to also just kind of like, you know, we get so many amazing newsletters, right? Like I get so many in my inbox, and I don’t have time to read them all. But how can I kind of just like quickly tag things and put things in some spaces where later I can be able to go utilize it. And I can’t say there’s probably never been a day where I’ve been in a session and I haven’t opened it like I go to it constantly. Because I know there’s going to be something there that at least at least if anything if I’m sitting with a teacher provokes a conversation I can be like, Oh my gosh, Chrissy, this makes me think about this video. Can I show it to you? What do you think about it right? And there’s like this excitement and the teachers feel like oh, wow, she’s like, doing all the things but guess what, like I didn’t sit there for like 16 hours researching. It’s just been this collection of things that I’ve had over time and curate so pocket is a fantastic one. back. And if you’re not using it, you have to start using it. It’s a great

buzzing with ms b 

one. That sounds amazing, because I’m thinking back to I mean, you know, I have like saved posts on my Instagram, you know, I have all the different things in categories, and we can only save it to one category on Instagram, and then you got Pinterest, but then that’s kind of a mess right now. And then, you know, you have to say things in multiple places, you know, you can’t just tag things and oh my gosh, that sounds amazing. Because then it’s it’s one source for everything. You’re not going wait, I had an email and I put it in my email folder marked whatever. Oh, wait, was that a video? Where do I see that video and you have to go back to the source. I love that. Yes, yeah. It’s a good one. Yeah, that sounds great. Well, I wonder if that isn’t your favorite thing right now. Because I asked everyone I’ve been asking everybody this season, what is your favorite thing and it can be a book, a movie, an activity, anything that you’re just really loving right now?

Jessica vance 

My favorite thing? I wouldn’t say that’s my favorite thing right now. That’s that’s been a tried and true favorite thing that I probably say my favorite thing is my new coffeemaker that my husband got me from my birthday. And it’s fancy and makes cappuccino and I love it. Super. Yeah. Just nothing I would ever buy for myself. So it was a really great surprise. And the funny thing about that is that when he gave me the bar, it was wrapped, you know, like husband’s wrap presents

buzzing with ms b 

were our bags.

Jessica vance 

And I was I mean, it was a pretty big box. And I was like, Oh no, what did he get me like I thought he got me like a household like appliance like vacu or a composter or something. And yes, it is technically an appliance. But then I opened it and I was pleasantly surprised. And he said, Well, I know you love cappuccinos and fancy and bougie coffee. And so I wanted to get to something. So favorite thing?

buzzing with ms b 

Yeah, that’s a great one. Yeah, that’s like it’s just like any garbage disposal or what is it this box? Yes. Well, that was a good job. Good job on him. He

Jessica vance 

did great. Yes, he did. He did.

buzzing with ms b 

So if people want to learn more about inquiry about reflection about how our language can influence our teachers, how can they find you online? Or in the real world?

Jessica vance 

Yeah. So as we connected on Instagram, I’m a really big proponent of sharing my practice sharing the things that I’m engaged in with my learners. So Instagram, Jess underscore Vance. Edu, I share a lot of different resources and ideas and just things that I’m kind of thinking about and curating over time. So I love the community over there. I know you do as well, and just kind of, you know, what comes from that same thing on Twitter, although I don’t know if Twitter’s like even a thing anymore in education. It’s kind of like it’s kind of Epping and flowing as everything is. Yes, yeah. So but yeah, I love the visual nature of Instagram anyway. And so actually, a lot of really great resources have come out of people asking questions and stuff like that. So definitely encourage your listeners to say hi over there. And then leading with inquiry.com is where you can find my book and book club and some other resources that necessary that aren’t necessarily housed on Instagram. So yeah, any of those different places, probably, you can find me. And lots of really great things happening this year. And I’m super grateful for the book and for where it is that it’s taking me and the different leaders and teachers and educators that I get to engage in this year. So perhaps some of your listeners will get to see me at an event this year. We’ll see. We’ll see.

buzzing with ms b 

All right, great. Well, thank you so much for being here today.

Jessica vance 

Thank you so much, Chrissy for having me back. And I will get to chat with you soon. I’m sure yes.

buzzing with ms b 

It was such a good episode, right? Like I just love listening to Jessica talk about the sincerity at which she approaches her work with and how we can use some of these ideas to kind of open the doors to different kinds of conversations with our teachers. So if you need some help, just thinking about ways to word things, you can grab some feedbacks and start us from me at buzzing with msp.com/episode 141 you just scroll down to the bottom, pop your email address in there and you will get those sentence starters. Next week we are actually doing some problem solving with a coach about the area of communication so I can’t wait to share that episode with you. I love doing coaching calls. It’s always so interesting to me and the one next week is no different. We talk about a lot of things and I am really excited to share it. So until then, happy coaching